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The Recipe for Trophy Walleye | Outdoor Journal Radio ep. 104
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Mar 24, 2025
This week on Outdoor Journal Radio, Ang and Pete are joined by Ted Putnam, owner of the world-renowned Hawk Lake Lodge, to talk about his personal experience in managing a trophy walleye population. First, however, a bit of housekeeping was in order. Topics discussed included: the origins of Bowrod; fish philosophy; our new look; pumping gas; New Brunswick muskie; cataracts for fish; whether fish are shrinking; injuries from the road; hornet stings, and breaking bones in the back country. With those matters out of the way, Ted joins the show! Topics discussed included: an update on Ted's Bruins; putting words in mouths; the Hawk Lake case study; trophy-only fisheries; the small fish of Hawk Lake; midday walleye fishing; BC's walleye population; dealing with fishing pressure; ice drinking; and much more! To never miss an episode of Outdoor Journal Radio, be sure to like, subscribe, and leave a review on your favourite podcast app! More from Angelo and Pete: ► WEBSITE ► FACEBOOK ► INSTAGRAM ► YOUTUBE Thank you to today's sponsors! Invasive Species Centre - Protecting Canada's land and water from invasive species Coleman Canada - The Outside is Calling, Answer the Call. CANADIAN ANGLERS: Outdoor Journal Radio and the Invasive Species Centre are looking for your help in getting information about our invasive Goldfish population. Fill out the quick survey to help us keep our waters safe from invasive species!
View Video Transcript
0:00
and now another exciting episode in The Adventures of Outdoor Journal
0:06
radio well howdy everybody thanks for joining us I'm Angelo Viola he is the
0:11
Peter Bowman howdy and Angelo howdy howy the B Rod
0:17
the B Rod came up back to get that napan I got that nickname of napan from my buddy JB I don't know how he came up
0:23
with it just one day he said we're up working out in the Universal machine and he says hey B Rod what what the that he
0:30
says well you like the hunt so we're bow and arrow and you like fish and you like a fishing rod he say B Rod I thought the
0:36
bow was bow of The Bowman no he he put it as the hunting and fishing of it yeah
0:41
uh as well as the usual cast of characters uh vaa Nick and Dean come on now making all of this wonderful magic
0:49
appear every week give me a hell yeah hell yeah uh wonderful program today uh
0:55
just uh um just to sort of give you the main subject matter later on we'll be
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joined by a good friend of ours his name is Ted putam and he owns what might be
1:07
handsome look at him he's oh he is a devil is he Deon Aire as well um what
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could argue I don't know whether it's arguable or not I guess somebody will argue with it it could be the best small
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Lake walleye fishing factory on the planet yeah Hawk Lake yeah could be the
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reason he's on the program today is because uh episode 102 that we produced
1:35
a few weeks ago uh that some of you hopefully have listened to already if not I urge you to go back to it uh we
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had a special guest by the name of Paul radomsky on he was a he's he not was he still is a scientist biologist doctor of
1:49
fish whatever you want to call him who wrote A fascinating book called doctor of fish I love it he's a fishology man
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ofish um that uh wrote a book called uh uh wle Walley a beautiful fish of the
2:03
dark and he was on the program and we talked about what went into publishing this book writing it and all the uh
2:09
different uh things about it and he T he he came up with some stuff he told us and we were both in shock absolutely and
2:17
that was the uh his philosophy on fish management and that's well and good but
2:24
uh a few weeks later after it it actually went up or dropped I guess they call it they call that dropping not they
2:30
Dean yeah it's called a drop called a drop that's what the kids call it I'm going to start calling it drop I want to be cool the kids call itop I want to so
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when it dropped uh our good friend Ted putam uh responded to it immediately and
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said holy smokes where did you find this character because uh Ted has some great
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practical experience some I don't know 10 12 probably got more practical experience not being a biologist but
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just in the in the field than anybody probably he's got one subject area and one subject fish you know what I mean
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boom and he had some things to dispute about uh this book and he went by the
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way he bought the book and read it later on and uh said to me wow what a fascinating gentleman this guy was
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anyways he's going to be on the program a little later on joining us to talk to us about what he's going to dispute
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about that wonderful publication stick around for this one people because his Ted is very knowledgeable and it's about
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Walley and it's about big Walley we all like to learn about that so and he takes no prisoners just so that you're no he's
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good he's good uh fishing Canada television show the new season is nicely
3:38
underway season 38 come on now I was watching come on now an interview uh
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program recently and um the main host of the show was talking to the guest and
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the guest was a uh actor who had been doing um uh
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series a series on television and they were talking about the fact that that they had just produced their
4:06
250th episode and I thought holy smokes that's a lot of programming 250 and then
4:13
you looked into our archives obviously prompted me to think well you idiot like you guys have done
4:19
over 600 you know and and we are over 600 oh
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my God 630 some some odd holy and that's not counting odj episodes wow that's fnc
4:32
only yeah yeah yeah yeah that's why we are now old oh yeah or we look old we're
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actually a middle age the two of us we're 22 each it's a hard life it's a hard life all that sun on the face you
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can see the redness all over yes she's a tough one folks lot of whiskey at nights
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you know oh there's a few of those smoking cigarettes and coughing and
4:57
wheezing we asked uh we don't smoke cigarettes everybody we asked no stop it we asked a few we asked
5:06
you uh if you've been watching the new season which just premiered in uh January of this year and if you noticed
5:12
anything new different um likes dislikes and let us know let us know what you
5:18
think yeah I don't think we've heard anything yet have we has anybody responded I've heard a lot from like
5:23
people who I know who watched it and they'd love it right but nobody's actually written into it to us there's
5:28
some there's some on YouTube I can pull up like all the comments and stuff people are really liking it I would like
5:33
to know I would like to hear from you if possible just uh give us your opinion on
5:39
um some of the things that have changed on the on the show let us know what you
5:45
think yeah yeah I I like the look of it ien been watching them me you and I you got to remember folks here s sitting
5:51
here in this office before it even hits the airwaves an and I and Dean to an extent Volvo for sure we see it so many
5:58
times just like oh my God over and over looking for this looking for that and you know what I mean and and try to get
6:04
it perfect and then but even then I watch it at home on the B on the big TV and it looks I just it looks so good on
6:10
a TV like that I just watched I just watched the
6:15
the episode you and Steve did yep it was on the weekend it was just on this was this weekend and you know like you said
6:22
I mean we we we've seen it a million times in the post production period y
6:27
totally different show when you when I watch this weekend I enjoyed the hell out of it yeah it's NE see not that I
6:33
didn't like it before but like you guys took me on this great adventure and and
6:38
and like I I felt your pay when when they needed to and you made it it was
6:43
perfect I love the show I love that episode yeah so let us know let us know what you think uh as well uh fishing
6:50
Canada the store free shipping still look at that stuff ehy I never
6:57
know which way to turn how's that there Journal we have this is these are hoodies there's there's sweatshirts
7:03
there's t-shirts there's pants sweatpants tkes I mean there's the Plaid
7:09
is the Plaid available yet well I know it's here I I just don't know whether there not up I I'm almost afraid to say
7:15
it's up on the store I don't know got I got you I know exactly where you're sitting in this situation I don't know
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okay enough said people more intelligent than me should be answering those
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questions I thought you're going to be saying running the show well there's that too there's that too I want to
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thank everybody by the way for uh making of This Outdoor Journal uh podcast what
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it is today it's it's a highly uh um I
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for the life of me I don't know why a highly respected uh outdoor product uh very well-received highly recognized and
7:54
we owe it all to you for making that happen because if we didn't have have
8:00
people downloading it and liking it and what else do they do Dean help me on
8:06
this one subscribe to it subscribe to it they put it on their Instagram and and
8:11
they do that yeah and it builds in our ratings right because we're like number two there to the to the meat eater
8:16
that's pretty damn good in a short time that we've done this so yeah so I want to thank all of you for making that happen CU like I said without you we
8:23
would be still I don't know pumping gas at the local Shell station did you do that aside from your dad grad did you
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ever pump gas anywhere else like for a job as a job DX oil DX oil do you even
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know what that is no I DX oil was on um um Highway
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2 just before you get into town here okay uh what's there now it's gone but I
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think a coffee Plaza with a big coffee shop is in there now that used to be DX
8:56
oil and uh I worked there for for probably I don't know till they caught
9:03
on to me and fired me uh probably for half a year putting gas in your own car
9:08
well there was a bit of that too I have to be honest you know just leing with Jerry cans at night hey who is that
9:16
guy I don't want to get in that just in case the folks from that company are still alive exact DX
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yeah uh listener feedback Mr Bowman listener feedback comes from at mitchc
9:29
5538 via YouTube in response to episode 103 our warm Winters hurting our
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Fisheries so we did that in episode 103 of Outdoor Journal podcast and uh
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Mitch's thought was I think the gradual warming could hurt rivers and lakes in the southern us but might benefit
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Northern lakes and rivers at least for bass they grow better in warmer water
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you can't dispute that what he's saying well certainly a large Mouse I don't know whether I'd agree with that that
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for small mouth right right cuz I think they may be affected large mouth and he's talking as if he is in the
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US um he's talking about rivers in in rivers and lakes in the southern us MH
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so I'm assuming could hurt gradu warming could hurt the rivers and lakes because yeah because the southern us obviously being Florida Texas nor Rivers at least
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uh for bass they grow better in warmer water so he's talking he's talking large mouth yeah he's talking B for sure
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nothing could be wor further from the truth for small mouth and fact that would probably be any of the rivers that
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we've got and by the way here's a here's something uh if you live in Southern Ontario and you're you're um near any
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pretty much any tributary that dumps into uh Lake Ontario um or any I think any of the
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Great Lakes you probably aren't aware of the fact unless you live on one of those
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rivers or tributaries that most of them have a great population of smallmouth bass MH they very few people fish yep
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and it's a great place to go with kids and and have them uh you know
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indoctrinate them into fishing by having even catch their first Smallmouth right because I can't think of a better fish
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that a kid could catch for the first time and get totally hooked on this
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thing we call fish in a river off the shore with a bit of current to help that smly yeah you know his great uh a great
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Smallmouth river is the the sine oh my God God I did that boat trip with every
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was it was Unreal a roll booat right and it was just it was insane any of these Rivers these uh you got to remember too
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um he's talking about the southern see when he talk about go back to larg mouth bass they're very adaptable creatures so
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and and I have fished as far south as Mexico for largemouth and I'll tell you what that water around there is peace
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soup almost all the time so in the 80s we were there in the water temperatures were in the 80s these large mouth had no
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problem living in that a little further north like Texas they get more Waters
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but they get waters in the 40s too you know comes winter time and and the temperatures drop around the areas and all that stuff the large mode they adapt
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Florida Florida the same thing go all the way up to canora Lake of the Woods there you right now that water is 32 33
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degrees they're living in that and then it goes to the 7s in the summer so they're very adaptable creature a large moou bass but but but says about the
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small moou you that might be a little different of a story they can handle it too but not maybe not as well trout that
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warming on trout not good at all right so no and this species that do well species that don't I think uh we ought
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to ask Ted that question if he you know he's in Northwestern Ontario cold water fishery predominantly cold water I'm
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going to ask him if I can remember if he if he has any concerns or if he's noticed any change in his fishery due to
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you know climate change or temperature because he keeps track of a lot of stuff so that be a good one yeah yeah uh am I
12:52
wrong here Dean and saying uh that were a little out of uh out of sync on these
12:58
Scripts this this wonderful day why is that well because we just did The Listener feedback and now we're going to
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go back to uh podcast highlights and then we're going to go back to fishing
13:10
Canada news I think that's how we do things no I normally think we do the podast the uh feedback portion
13:17
disagreeing with Dean I'm not disagreeing I'm just saying you're challenging de you're challenging I yeah
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go back and check the I got a feeling that Dino Dino just copies and pastes just has that
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out and in out and in that is totally unusual but anyways uh podcast Network
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highlights cuz you know we have a podcast Network come on now well come on
13:40
now for those of you who didn't know you now know um and uh the Highlight this uh
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week is the ugly Pike podcast which if you're not listening to it you're really
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not into big Predator fishing whether it's Pike or or musky mostly musky but
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they do everything they do everything uh the episode this week is episode uh 63
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and 4 One 63 164 well I meant that yeah people knew that okay that's that's a
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given it's just a number right who cares about it as if they're going to go search for they're going to go search
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for Marlon Prince correct who is a guest on that EP two episodes by the way two
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episodes uh Marlon Prince a good friend of ours that we fished with in New
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Brunswick uh musky angler hey look at that goodlooking guy he's got a green bass there what is
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that that's look at the color of that sucker man those are those are different he those fish down there they are look
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at the belly on that that is a New Brunswick muscal right there folks and they get big anyways a fascinating
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episode on ugly Pike featuring Marlin prince who helped us shoot those
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episodes Marlin is a is a very deadly stick out there that's for sure he knows his stuff on the musk fishes too
15:01
okay right deadly went to the bar and I'll tell you I found out he had a whole other side there with that Mar with that
15:08
deadly stick work of his right yeah yeah anyways I got a dead stick he dead seor
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oh my maybe you wanted to explain to folks what e dead Senor means I don't understand you're Spanish my friend all
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right look I'm BR uh he talks about the politics of
15:27
Musky fishing especially as it pertains to the eastern part of the country and there's a lot of it and there's a lot
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ofs going on you mind-blowing it's a great interview you want to check it out
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ugly Pike broadcast episodes 163 and 164
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featuring Marlin Prince come on now
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indeed carry on do we want to do uh both stories here quickly I don't know it's all out of order to me we got a couple
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of news stories today and this one is uh I'm not comfortable with that but I'll do what Dean makes us do right he's the
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boss right so this this is a weird news story this is one stripe is titled
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stripe bass given cataract surgery live longer so first of all somebody had to
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think this up exactly somebody and you know and you know we've
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come up with got good eyes we've come up with the especially Walley in fact that episode that you and Steve uh produced
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that aired this weekend uh Network Coast to Coast global television network 8: a.m. and it's
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available now on YouTube as well that episode that Angelo's talking about and Sportsman's Channel as well as wfn but
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anyways that particular Channel you guys caught a walleye that could have used this surgery cuz it had like an opaque
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coating on we guessed it was blind in the eye but maybe it was just you know maybe it just had a cataract in it maybe I don't know what it was but now for the
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life of me we won't get into the story but for the life of both both of us when we first saw this we thought what what
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kind of group what kind of funding does it take to get the biologists to work on
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cataracts on strip bass like why okay so the only thing that would make sense to me the and it's not here so I but I've
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got to say the only thing that would make sense to me is that maybe they're using fish wasn't just stripers either
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says including stripe bats incling fish um it's a fascinating Story by it's a great read you you need to go to fishing
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canada.com and check this out in the news section but the only thing that would make sense to me is that they're
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using this research to help them better understand the whole cataract surgery
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thing as it applies to humans ah guinea pigs rat rat lab sort of speaking sort
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of uh but but but otherwise like how how would you apply
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this how would you apply this to fish they were all 10 years over 10 years old so depending on how long a striper lives
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if a striper lives for 20 years and she is a prime spawner at 10 or 11 and that
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their eyesight helps them maybe that might be the only thing I could think of like you know what I mean like otherwise why it's
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ridiculous I don't know it's ridiculous and and with all due respect to the folks who were in this I I'm sure that
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you you worked hard what's Dr Claire Verno
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gret professor of Zoological medicine at the uh faculty of veterinary medicine at
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University oh here University de Montreal okay I get it no no
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not their results show that 73% of the operated fish resumed feeding regained
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normal body condition and appeared clinically normal the Medan survival time was around one year which is posit
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a positive outcome for fish of this age she [Music] said any put Dean on this one I don't
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know uh who put the money towards it it seems strange to me and they only lived one year it said the average fish lived
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one year so I don't know if the median survival time was around one year okay that doesn't bother me as much as if
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you're doing this for fish which I don't think they are but if
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it is intended as as a program that will enhance the um quality of life for fish
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as they get on in age like that just does not make
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sense to me but it also doesn't make sense to me that why would you use fish to study for human problem maybe there's
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something similar between you think that maybe it' be a mammal versus a a fish like somebody that something that has
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air lives in the air in the atmosphere versus under the water I don't know fascinating story if you like these
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funky stories uh you got to read this one we're full of funk that's for sure oh boy it's it's Don fishing canada.com
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the news section yes sir of it uh also in news uh main study concl what is this
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all all weird didn't gave us a couple of stories today in case he said I don't know which ones you'd like I love them
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all buddy uh main study concludes that fish
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are shrinking I know I'm shrinking and I was never big to begin with I was shrunk and
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I'm shrinking more damn nobody nobody's studying that are they they're
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shrinking Peter fish apparently are shrinking well you and I we've noticed that a lot everyone we catch seems to be
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getting smaller we can't catch a two-b bass anymore damn it it's part of an international project uh with 16 other
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research centers okay uh this particular one is out of the Maine ecology it's
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University of Maine ecology Professor Brian McGill he helped uh do this study
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and they analyzed the body size trends of numerous plants and animals worldwide
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from 1960 to 2020 using data from the biotime database and they have concluded
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ladies and gentlemen fish are
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shrinking there oh my again I have to ask like as our previous one is why why
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why are they because they need okay all right for
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somebody somebody has has been collecting data from 1960 to 2020 otherwise they
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couldn't have done this research somebody had to be collecting this stuff so whoever collected this stuff was getting paid somebody paid
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them to collect this this doesn't fall out out of trees so there's a data center that's
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got all this information so now we we we have another group and by the way they're all over the world um who's
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getting paid to collect all this data and come up with the fact that fish
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are shrinking so they're trying to find out why so that they can com combat that I'm assuming so that we can't have fish
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shrinking we need fish growing oh I see what so maybe maybe there's a okay so
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the Silver Lining to this is once it's all done and tabulated um we need to now we're going
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to do a study on why inject our Bait fish with super proteins that uh that
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ultimately build these big muscular like that there's another big of muscular in
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that entire picture I'm G to tell you that right now oh my God I tell you there is that's a shrinking fish by the
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way that fish is good re reappearing in another episode this year that little for those listening those people
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listening the that's a picture of a wall that I caught on KB Lake it's about 2 in 2 in long maybe 3 inch long something
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like that that would be fresh out of the womb wouldn't it be pretty much
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we I got him I got I need to drink no that's that's that's that year fish
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for sure you know that same year I got that July or whatever Our Guest is coming on he'll know a thing or two
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about those we'll have to ask him about yeah that size of fish he knows all good
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things um yeah anyways I don't think his fish are shrinking we'll find that out too well they're not definitely not
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shrinking which is which is you know something he might want to dispute the
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story I don't know Ted's good at that stuff see now we to the fan question which normally makes sense now but but
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it would be fan question along with the other one that we did earlier on with
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the fans comment comments anyways uh fan question this week from you want me to
23:43
know sure go ahead comes from stepen Anastasia is that right d Anastasia
23:48
Anastasia from Ontario via email info@ fishing canada.com or Facebook or Instagram if you want to do it that way
23:54
but what is the worst injury you have sustained while on location shooting a
24:00
show whoa great question I know yours I think I know yours already um
24:05
my I don't think I can't outdo yours that's for sure I can't outdo yours I'm say I've had a I've had a couple of them
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actually I've had a few um what's
24:18
yours I'll tell think of yours I'll tell you a a not an injury but a mishap that
24:24
we had one time oh that be in a in a tournament yeah was B my Hospital yeah
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bee stung my ring finger and it SW up so bad they tried to cut the ring I still got the cut mark on it the girl in there
24:36
she was on on her last five minutes of her shift and pissed off that I came in there so she was digging she was trying
24:42
to break that ring off my finger let alone saw it through she was like I got to go home French girl she was fraking
24:47
funny and I was sweating like a pig but but my my the reason I went in said my
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my finger was swelling on both sides of the Ring getting bigger and bigger and bigger and the ring wasn't doing anything tell folks why you were SW
24:59
swollen stung by a a white jacket a white jacket wasper Hornet whatever they called so that was had reached into
25:06
reached in my our bag but there was a backpack we had underneath and I thought a fish hook stuck me I thought jeez an I
25:11
got stuck by a hook then all of a sudden this guy starts crawling around says oh my God I got stung and then all of a sudden she just went for a a oh
25:18
like there was no it was brutal like it was I I thought it was going to explode yeah it did look like it was going to explode for sure but and then eventually
25:26
she tried so you got a picture this you got the little Handa it's a tiny little
25:31
skill saw that you turn by hand it's like a little windup clock it's most insane thing and they have a hook on
25:37
goes underneath the ring so this is why your hands all swollen up and soore and they get it underneath there and she's going and she trying to goes fast you
25:43
can because she wants to get off her shift and all that and finally I said whoa whoa whoa whoa stop stop I said she
25:51
I says give me that KY gel her baby I did she was kind of cute too
25:59
thank you de and I greased that some up and I just said that's it and I almost cried I was
26:05
just and and I'll remember this forever she looks up and she goes oh you got it
26:11
all she said you got it yeah I got it see you later honey have a good weekend so anyways I remember that one what else
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what other yours no yours oh mine I know I got uh not an injury but I I caught
26:25
laryngitis oh in Alberta right before I shoot and that was bad because we were ready we were scheduled the next day we
26:30
were traveling to the next Lake Lester Slave Lake and I remember that forever that we went to the hospital then too
26:36
and got me in there cuz we wanted to when we got evacuated that night that's the same trip I same trip the
26:43
flood came and we we got evacuate at like 3:00 in the morning we had to get the H but anyways that wasn't an injury
26:48
but it was like a catastrophe cuz we had to go and then we we went okay the next day I was getting a little better the next day I got all kinds of meds and
26:55
they uh and so I said to an okay you carry the show and I'll just every now and then I'll say yeah yeah good one
27:00
buddy stuff like that or whatever like that we got away with it and we couldn't really tell but it was uh yeah but yours
27:06
is the best mine if we're talking about the broken broken bones yeah we had just flown in to um a
27:16
remote airdale it was an airdale location yeah yeah and uh pilot dropped
27:23
us off and off he went and I was it the same day no next
27:30
morning no because we were next morning yeah next morning early next morning I
27:35
broke an ankle and uh I think we still had four or five
27:42
days before the plane was coming back so I kind of uh I had some I was going to
27:47
say I survived it but I had some help the local camp uh dude he brought he
27:54
brought on a bag of pills that would have blown your mind I think you could have to fill the pillowcase with the pills that this guy had and from that
28:01
day we've always made sure to carry medication and and uh I don't think we have that kind of medication he had but
28:07
a kit uh survival kit with us in case we get injured but at that time we weren't traveling with any thankfully he had
28:15
some medication that helped me through it because otherwise I don't know yeah we' had a satellite phone and get you
28:20
flown out of there because it was that bad I mean you're in a we were in a remote spot where the plane drops you off and says see you in 3 or four days
28:27
whatever it is and then it's all of a sudden boom he snaps his ankle so the worst part about that though was that we
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were scheduled to get picked up from there and go into Betty McGee's Place Pine Portage p l which was another
28:41
Flyin and so I was medicated all week so for me it
28:48
didn't feel that bad Jack was with us on that whole trip wasn't he from radio world was with us and it didn't feel
28:54
that bad so I said you know what the hell with the guy guys let's just go
28:59
from here right into Betty McGee's Place P page the hell with it I'll I'll tough it out I'll be good so that's what we
29:06
did and worst thing I could have done when I finally got out of there it was a
29:11
high uh compound fracture high up on the ankle which are the worst ones you could
29:17
possibly do so I was in a one of those imilast forever to keep me from moving
29:24
it but yeah that happened out in the field I the worst the the best is when we got to Betty's place oh my the dock
29:31
the dock is like 200 200 feet long I'm not it seems like 200 yards L A longest dock in existence in the north for sure
29:38
and the flow plane obviously the flo plane comes to the very end of the dock and they tease it up to the end of the dock so we got an got 200 ft to go just
29:45
to get to on ground so they brought out a golf cart and said sat him in the golf cart he carried the gear and an and he
29:52
he went around in the golf cart the whole week back and forth he couldn't couldn't walk so it was oh my God that was funny and then we got we had to stop
29:58
at the S St Marie Hospital right after we got out Su or Thunder Bay no Sue St Marie we were on our way home yeah so
30:05
anyways it was a disaster but that's the worst I've had lots of uh hooks oh you
30:12
used to be the K that I've had to go into hospital for several times on body parts they the worst one though the
30:19
worst hook incident I ever had is on the Red River you might not even Rec were
30:24
you there for that your leg uh no my thumb oh yeah yeah yeah and what had happened was um we were using these big sash
30:33
hooks for these cats these cats are massive these are 20 to 30 35 in fact I
30:38
caught a 35 pounder on that shoot they're massive fish and so you got these big uh big circle hook type of
30:46
thing and they are razor sharp and so I got this cat and I got a
30:53
pair of needl noose pliers and I've got and the hook won't come out and I'm pushing down on
31:01
on the shank of the hook maybe with the needle nose pliers and I got my thumb
31:07
kind of like that and I slipped and that sharp Point ripped right through my
31:15
thumb right down to the bone about an inch an inch worth of gash and I went to
31:20
the hospital for that that was a bad one man I remember that but I finished the episode I don't know you remember that
31:26
was in the middle of the that big 34b cat so obviously we went to the hospital
31:33
in um Winnipeg I guess that would make sense cirk is where we were right yeah
31:38
we were in cirk and got all stitched up and bandaged up and came back and finish
31:45
the episode with a Band-Aid on my thumb and the only people who really notice it is us when you see that episode you'll
31:52
see that I start without a Band-Aid for the first part of the show and then I got a bandaid at the end true so it's
31:57
kind of cool oh God we've had lots of hook injuries not lately knock on wood no
32:03
you're right knock on wood lately we've been pretty good pretty much you know what that is old age experience we're
32:09
getting better buddy think about it take we're getting better I'll take that we didn't know at the time with foolish
32:15
young we didn't know hooks all over fers out hell not
32:22
[Music] now
32:29
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maps.com remember to never dump your life into the water and risk spreading other Aquatic Invaders keep our legs
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free from Invaders and don't let them [Music]
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loose there's an adventure just outside these walls it's something you'll hate to leave and can't wait to get back to
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podcast all right as promised our good friend Ted putam on the program uh he's been uh on before he is the owner um
35:32
of arguably the best Walley fishery on the planet in terms of a small uh Lake
35:39
and I use that uh with reverence uh yeah no it is Hawk Hawk Lake to me is
35:45
one of the best walleye Fisheries on the planet and his lodge Hawk Lake Lodge is one of the best uh welcome to the
35:51
program Teddy thanks guys good to be back uh nice nice to have you nice to have you
35:58
You' been doing well you just got some big redfish some big bull Reds didn't you oh man I love catching 30 in Walley
36:04
but when you catch 30 pound or 40 pound you know big bull Reds we had a great time down in Southern Louisiana what a
36:10
blast just a blast what uh what prompted that was this a bucket list thing or it's kind of a bucket list thing and it
36:16
was warm down there and fishing Flats uh sight fishing for just monster fish I've
36:21
always wanted to do it and you know Jet Blue had a sale and away I went it was great nice before we get into the meat
36:27
and potatoes I I've been dying to ask you and I keep forgetting did you in
36:33
your wildest dreams and I want to honest answer
36:38
here did you ever think that once you got rid of your captain and arguably
36:44
your best second best centerman on that team that that they were going to go on another extraordinary run that might see
36:51
them break another record I'm talking about the Boston Bruins obviously of course you are yeah I know
36:57
that's kind of icing on the cake right we just thought this would be sort of a rebuilding year obviously we got some great goalies but it's been better than
37:04
any of us could have expected that's for sure I said finally the Leafs are going to kick some ass with the Bruins thank
37:10
God Bron's gone oh God no kidding congratulations man good for you got be
37:17
it's nice to be living in Boston no kidding all right so the reason Ted's here we uh did an episode it was
37:24
actually episode number Dean c i I know you'll correct me um Dean is going to be
37:29
episode 102 there you go come on now thank you Dean look at that uh we had an
37:35
interesting episode and that gentleman was on more than just once as well his name is Paul romsky and he was an author
37:43
of a great book called Walley a beautiful fish of the dark now he's a
37:48
Fisheries biologist correct or no yeah that's correct okay so there's some science involved here which is great but
37:55
he came on and and said some profound things that were in the book that uh at
38:01
the time if you watch go back and watch that episode you'll see that both Pete and I were like what are you talking
38:08
about and it wasn't too far down the road where there where our good buddy Ted putam reached out to us and said
38:15
what was that quack talking about he didn't call him a quack he did
38:21
you made that up you improvised he called him something may might might have been worse than but anyways uh he
38:29
said hey Teddy you just can't hold him back can you hey buddy a good story Angelo and a good what is that all about
38:36
you know I've got field experience here that tells me that some of what uh Paul
38:43
wrote about and said it's just not true and so we said well let's get Teddy on the show and let's debate it let's talk
38:48
about it and we even sit on that episode Ted we know a guy who's got a body of water that might argue some of these
38:55
facts about big fish and the the uh uh need for um calling some of those big
39:03
fish so here's your your big opportunity tell us now you've read the book right
39:09
you've since gone out and bought the book and read it I actually have since got out and bought the book and I was
39:15
skimming through it this weekend yes there some of the highlights uh good book very detailed he's definitely done
39:21
great work so that was that was I appreciate you letting me know where I could find it that was good but let me
39:27
first start out I am not a scientist I have done any statistical analysis I
39:32
didn't go to school and get a PhD in biology or fisheries management uh I'm
39:38
just a lowly Lodge owner uh so what I have uh really is kind of boots on the
39:43
ground experience in a fishery for 26 years that I have tightly managed for 14
39:49
years uh and what I found U maybe a little different than maybe what other people have uh come come up with in sort
39:57
of theories and analyses and I think it's actually very interesting some of the things that I found versus what are
40:02
the some of the things you were talking about on your last podcast okay all right so let's jump let everybody just
40:09
for everybody when we found out about Ted's Lake we heard this is a pretty
40:14
much a trophy only lake or or that's what you really go up for Northwestern Ontario where Ted is he's close to canor
40:21
he's close to the Lake of the Woods in that whole area normally that's known as as more numbers people are the first
40:26
perception is there's giant fish there and yeah there are but it's a place where you can catch two 300 16 18 in in
40:32
a day right so that's the perception when you hear a lake like Ted's where we we talk to Ted and he says oh we don't
40:37
get a whole lot of those we get a lot of big ones a lot of trophies a ton of trophies they're there but so you got to remember the last when we heard this we
40:43
said oh my God we got to check this Lake out was for our first trip and sure as hell we got there and we got Giants and
40:48
we didn't catch small ones and what sold it for me I watched uh the Linder episode shot up there yeah and uh man
40:56
and that that put it over the top for me so like Pete said we had to we had to come up and experience it now Pete said
41:01
something interesting though about a number of fish people going into
41:06
Northwestern Ontario expecting 100 200 fish days um which are common but I
41:13
don't want to take away from the fact that you know Hawk Lake isn't the only Big Lake fishery up in Northwestern
41:20
Ontario there are a number of other lakes and I think genetics may have a lot to do with it in your case I think
41:26
It's a combination of genetics and really off-the-wall management which is
41:31
what you've done um and to let the folks know what Ted has done with Hawk lake is
41:37
you don't keep anything nothing zero not even a Shore lunch there's no retention
41:44
of fish on Hawk Lake and because you're the only operator on the body of water
41:50
is that correct sure and there's no Public Access either no Public Access which in the summer in the winter time
41:56
they can access it right in the winter you can get in but I would argue that you can do a lot less damage over the ice and you can if you're fishing It All
42:03
Summer Long in a Prov I agree so uh Paul uh states in the book that in fact we as
42:10
managers fish managers should maybe take a different approach to managing walleye
42:16
lakes and that is that you know maybe we should be taking out a few or some of
42:22
the bigger fish and let the smaller fish grow that that mid-range population
42:28
which is important in his in his book it's important to maintain a nice balanced
42:35
system that doesn't happen on Haw Lake like we've fished it now I don't know how many times four or five times we've
42:41
never caught a small walleye that's correct we have not caught a small the smallest walleye we probably caught a
42:47
four pounder would be our smallest maybe it's like that would come couple of things we're actually catching tons of
42:54
small oil right now tons and I've got the numbers have back that up which is pretty cool but let's go through you
42:59
know one thing at a time yeah your first comment was or Paul's comment was maybe it's a good idea to call some fish out
43:06
based on whatever you want slots or whatever so you create a healthy fishery
43:12
and I just don't quite get that because let's just put this into a different perspective 150 years ago there was no
43:19
one touching these fisheries and I bet you the Fisheries were doing just great so it's only when man comes in and
43:25
starts ruin around where now all of a sudden we're having these conversations so I don't understand how the fishery
43:31
was great before we showed up and now that we've showed up we need to start calling fish out so we can make it more
43:37
healthy that makes no sense to me at all uh don't quite get that in my case we
43:42
it's completely hands off and the fishery has rebounded exponentially far the far exceeding my expectations and
43:50
I've got some neat numbers that so we can talk about in different classes that I've been monitoring it's been really
43:56
cool all right so you have zero retention on Big Fish small fish little
44:03
in between fish etc etc is that every species Tad Pike walleye Smallmouth lro
44:09
white fish everything catch and Bree cross the board cross the board wow okay
44:14
which listen it makes sense to me it makes total sense to me but I'll be
44:20
honest with you after you know this book came to light you start questioning it
44:26
certainly in other parts of the country if not the province uh we are experimenting with different types of
44:32
management tools you know you mentioned slot limits uh there's all kinds of
44:38
things and and not one sort of standard rule right now it's all over the map I've never seen it like this before I
44:45
don't know Ted if you know the Canadian regs or the Ontario regs where your lodges in but there's so many different RS just in walleye alone and then you go
44:51
to large mode small mode you go to musk yeah every species is crazy so you really got to know your EGS well it kind
44:58
of makes sense because you can't really have one size fits all anyway I mean it's based on the region and the fishery
45:03
and how much pressure it's getting so I think you need to be creative and how you approach each each one of those
45:08
Fisheries uh and go from there you can't just make a blanket statement and that's for the entire province that would never
45:14
work well they tried that before that's what it used to be and now it used to be six across the board right six walleye
45:19
and all that but now it's they' changed it and thank God they did you know what I mean so you mentioned smallfish when did you start noticing these small fish
45:27
uh about four years ago we started noticing them and maybe you can answer this question because I I don't
45:32
understand why uh see that he said speaking of small fish he asked us right say he's not a small fish guy he's
45:38
making fun yeah we're Experts of small fish well no no no no that's not what I mean in fact we started getting into them actually after dark after the the
45:45
typical big bik has turned off about half an hour after Sunset like all the little fish would start coming in and I
45:52
have no idea why that is I'd love to talk to a biologist why that is Maybe because the big fish have now stopped
45:57
their feeding and now the little fish can get into some of these schools of bait I don't know but we literally could go out and just Hammer you know 12 to 15
46:04
inch fish nonstop you know until either the bugs or you know the darkness got to us so that was pretty cool or you're
46:11
sitting in that nice little Narrows of yours at dusk and you just pounded 3210
46:16
lb walleye maybe they're they're done for the night Ted with all due respect okay maybe you got them got them all and
46:23
now the little guys have got a chance they got a to start feeding it's possible too that is possible I
46:29
otherwise I would not have an answer to that like you would think they'd be the opposite those big girls would be right
46:34
in that prime time and you know dusk right into the dark the first hour or two of dark and then okay we'll rest for
46:40
but obviously that's not not the case on Hawk anyways right I read something some about that about you know our perception
46:47
of walleye is U low light into dark and through the dark period and then back
46:54
right up to that early morning light but I've read something recently that kind of dispels that and the prime time is
47:02
that dusk period as opposed to total darkness there's something I'll pull it
47:08
out I'll find it and I'll send it off to you Ted it's an interesting read you you know what else very I'm just going to go
47:13
off a little bit here in location this year I noticed especially when we're doing this this late season trophy wall
47:19
fishing on the Adolphus reach midday is the absolute best for the big girls it's
47:25
soon as it got to 3:00 and started to start shut down Gandhi I don't know you can see some stuff it made no sense but
47:32
in the middle of the day was sun with it doesn't matter what but the middle of the day are these the fish that are traveling or are these the local fish
47:40
that you're talking about no no these are The Travelers these are the the uh spawners that are maybe maybe it's has
47:46
to do with with that migration maybe during Prim but there stay the screen on the Garment stayed exactly the same you
47:52
know what I mean we saw them after just exactly what we were rolling through earlier just they they just didn't bite
47:58
at that perfect time in the morning and in the evening I have no IDE that was bizarre so the older I get the less I
48:04
know um share with us please some numbers I know you're dying to talk to us about that well I'm not dying to but
48:10
I was I mean I obviously track all the trophy fish and I have for years and I use that obviously in marketing and the
48:16
guys want to come catch 30s and we catch hundreds and hundreds of fish 28 plus but the last two years I found something
48:22
sort of interesting where we catching a lot of 26s in 27s and that excited me only for the for
48:30
the reason that in my opinion they were much more fun to catch them a 30 I mean they were screaming out line like a
48:36
tarpon they would hit like a freight train and I was thinking to myself wow where did all these 26s come from so now
48:43
that I knew we were going to be on this program I did a little research in terms of now how old are are fish based on
48:51
their size certainly in Northern Ontario and I found something that's got to be some some whatat close where they say a
48:57
26 in walleye in Northern Ontario is roughly 19 or 20 years old okay keep
49:03
that in mind 20 years old just nice ballpark now uh the eaters we typically
49:08
think of eaters as around 17 inches right you know the play is big enough to get a nice chunk there's still pretty tender meat pretty good okay and eater
49:16
is around eight years old okay so you got 20 and8 if you do the math that's 12
49:22
years which is almost exactly when I went to 100% Catch and Release so those
49:28
17inch eaters which we were not keeping and eating in 2011 and 2012 they are all 26 and there are hundreds of them and
49:36
you know that's not scientific analysis that's just math uh and I just I just did this today it's like well that kind
49:42
of makes sense look at all that they've all grown up and now we're catching fish couple that with the smaller fish and
49:48
you know it's a bonanza now the other thing I found was um once they hit 29 29
49:54
and a half at least on my fishery that's kind of end of life that's a 28y old fish because what I found was over the
50:01
last few years we've averaged maybe 250 fish 28 or 29 inches long but once you
50:08
hit 30 it just drops off a mountain like instead of uh 230s we caught
50:14
6830s and then we caught 40 31s etc etc so it's not like those fish go into
50:20
hiding my fishermen are very good um I think that's kind of the end of life a 30-year-old w i mean that that's an
50:26
ancient fish uh but I also thought that was interesting as well but my first point was we did catch releast literally
50:33
133 years ago and now we're seeing those 13 inch fish grow up uh to be really some beautiful uh
50:39
monsters that's an interesting uh some interesting numbers so cool um would
50:46
Hawk Lake be a good representation of that whole North
50:52
Western band of lakes could this apply to say bigger bodies of water like
50:58
LAX well again I'm not a scientist but in my opinion I mean it's it's it's all
51:04
really based on the food supply if you got the food supply that can manage a fishery like this then absolutely now
51:11
typically a deeper Lake will have more of a food supply because not only do you have you know the perch up top but then
51:16
you got the cisos you got the white fish and all the way down to the bouret which we have all of those so we've got an
51:22
amazing fish supply um or fish food source right so I I don't see why it
51:28
couldn't um but I'm really not the right person to ask I'm just telling you the numbers that I've seen it's exploded it
51:35
really has taken off and it's it's kind of it's kind of neat to see what's the maximum depth of Hawk Lake what do you
51:40
got there for dep uh I have I have charted 370 feet wow okay so it's yeah
51:46
you're definitely got Cisco base or or smelt or both or whatever right along with minnows and perch and everything
51:52
else I'm assuming wow sure interesting and big white fish I've seen white fish
51:57
is 10 or 12 pounds it's a fascinating Lake and and for those folks listening that uh have
52:05
no idea what we're talking about uh you got to go check out some of the episodes that we produced up there and not only
52:10
ours but I I mentioned Al uh Linder was there a few times he shot episodes up
52:15
there um that's how we first found out that's we first found out you got to see what's going on up at up at this Hawk
52:21
Lake it's it's kind of spooky I'll be honest with you when you look at it you say wait a minute what's he doing it's
52:27
kind of an anomaly isn't it what's he doing I mean because there are other well-managed lakes that we're uh
52:35
familiar with that have walleye that are not doing quite as well as you are on Hawk lake so I think it's a combination
52:41
of great management I think it's a it's genetically these fish that you've got
52:47
are unique in my opinion totally unique and and that might be running right
52:52
across the board with with with all enclosed walleye Lakes for all we know you know each each genan pool might be
52:59
totally different that will allow them if given the opportunity because what you did is given the opportunity by
53:05
having a a no retention policy if given the opportunity to feed and and lead a
53:11
normal lifestyle these fish will just grow and grow and grow and and I think
53:16
that's part of it as well but you do have unique situation up there because
53:21
in all fairness to other people who manage their Fishery they don't have total control one thing
53:27
is you've got the lake to yourself you don't have to worry about another
53:34
operator or two doing different things to the fish than you are um access to
53:42
getting boats in there that is kind of a unique situation as well um so I think
53:47
you've like you're checking off all the boxes with Hawk Lake it's an
53:53
extraordinary and i d I I really want to use the word unique certainly we have never found anything quite that even our
54:02
Western BC uh uh walleye lake that's a bowl it's a bowl but it's Unique and
54:07
that it has no access it has no pressure uh all that stuff but it's a totally different animal and it does not have as
54:15
big a walleye as what Ted has well we've only fished one tenth one 100th of that
54:21
Lake right we go to the there and over there and then we're done we catch a ton of big ones too but I just you know what
54:28
I think Hawk there is something different about Hawk I don't know what it is like we said none all three of us here aren't biologist but there's
54:33
definitely some it's a perfect Walley Lake in the sense of you could say that a perfect Walley Lake might not have
54:39
four 300 fet of water or something like that but why not you know maybe it is the perfect ball because it has that but
54:45
every in every sense you just every time Ted sends you down to a to a rock pile down on a uh to a bay around through the
54:51
Narrows and all that it just opens up and you go oh my God we are are in the whole lake is so perfect for Walley so
54:58
uh I mean maybe it is the ultimate setup for Walle between bait between structure
55:04
between depth who knows you know what I mean and it's just all working together both Ted and uh and you got a great
55:10
fishery getting back to the book very lucky yes getting back to the book then Ted uh the book that Paul uh romsky
55:18
wrote uh authored um are you disagreeing
55:24
with are you just are you disagreeing with his whole uh
55:29
philosophy or are you just saying hey that's well and good maybe that's the majority of lakes can uh be ruled by
55:38
those those thought process but but my Lake Hawk lake is different is that what you're
55:44
saying am I disagreeing with his entire philosophy no absolutely not I I think
55:49
that a lot of uh his hard work analysis uh is based on lakes that that have
55:55
pressure and we're fishing and have been for decades and now what do we do to try to save some of these lakes and I I
56:02
think he spot on absolutely uh we've got to try different things it's not a one-size fits-all uh and all these
56:09
biologists U are trying to do the same thing I am not disagreeing with any of that at all I guess what I found is in
56:15
this unique situation that I have I just put this experiment into the place and
56:20
the numbers sort of speak for themselves um I think if you take away all the fish uh we've got great Fisheries all over
56:27
the place where where you get into some conundrums is when you add fishermen into the mix all of a sudden it all goes
56:33
to hell and we have to decide how to address it and it's it's not one siiz fits-all every body water is different
56:39
how hard is it getting fish what's the base Supply etc etc etc so by no means
56:45
am I disagreeing with anything in fact I I believe uh he said that uh there are
56:50
different ways to uh uh that you can apply a fishery uh management technique and get different results uh and I think
56:57
that's very smart yeah um of Interest too you mentioned wher we
57:03
have fisherman first of all do you have a number that you could share with us um can you give us an idea of how many
57:11
human beings would be on your Lake in a
57:16
one-year period per season you mean you mean just my fisherman
57:22
yep uh I book around 1,00 nights more or
57:27
less per summer so that's 1500 fishing Fisher or fishing nights so
57:34
let's say that's two 400 people at four night four nights per person so three to
57:41
400 people are fishing my lakes in the summer more or less that's Ballpark and and the Reas the reason I mentioned that
57:49
you know we sometimes you have to bring it into perspective um because even even May and
57:55
and you you'll probably disagree with this but maybe a number like that even if the management isn't quite as tight
58:02
as yours those fish would do well anyways we're dealing with Lakes down here where they would get and I'm I'm
58:11
talking about L skoog as an example where they would get that kind of
58:16
pressure in a day yeah a day or a weekend yeah for sure for sure a weekend but probably in a day and lo and behold
58:24
we've had to shut Lake down that lake is complet and it used to be a walleye Factory it was when I was growing up
58:31
Lake skoog was a walleye Factory you could not go near that Lake without making contact with a walleye and but
58:39
but then you know you're it's it's a half hour maybe 45 minutes away from 6 million people and
58:47
so obviously it's got overfished and and and to the point where they had to shut it down uh years ago and it's still shut
58:54
shut down nothing's changed because of the pressure it's the pressure it's it's really that simple and was it gour piser
59:01
or someone else you know who you had on your show who said catch and release fishing has a mortality rate of 8 to 10
59:07
per. so just do the math if you got 400 people a day on a lake like that even if they're throwing everyone back they're
59:13
still killing a lot of fish unbeknownst to them and just think of the damage that oh us fishermen can do whether we
59:19
want to do it or know it or not it's a great point and so basically Hawk Lake
59:25
and we keep going back to this magic little piece of water called you know
59:30
Hawk Lake and Hawk Lake Lodge I think it's the perfect storm you know I think it's uh remote enough from the big
59:39
population base it has um very there's a lack of access for the general public uh
59:46
it has a brilliant manager who who controls the
59:52
fishery and very little pressure and I think when you put all of those into it
59:58
and you stir it all up in a pot you end up with this crazy bizarre world I mean
1:00:03
it's way I can describe where you go out there you're pretty confident that you're going to get close to double digit walleye pretty much every time out
1:00:11
which doesn't happen in the real world Ted I don't know whether you know that or not so no trust me I get it I I
1:00:17
realize that we are very blessed I I definitely realize and I appreciate that it's hey Teddy a question for you have
1:00:23
you ever been at the lodge you probably have cuz it's later up there have you ever run up in the lodge when the Walley
1:00:29
spawn is on and you're out there with the flashlight at night just looking around and seeing how how many fish are you know on the shores on the shes etc
1:00:37
etc uh Every Spring I'm there when the Walley spawn is on of course because
1:00:42
we're ripping across the Lakes getting all the out Lakes we have 22 other Lakes we got to get to right and you don't have to be out there at night I mean the
1:00:49
males are all over those humps and Shores like all over the place it's pretty neat and then you go out in the
1:00:55
go out in the evening and the females creep up there uh I mean no one will believe this uh but um one person had a
1:01:01
40 to their boat and I totally believe that but we saw a fish uh that we swore
1:01:07
was like a massive Pike on one of these spawning wreaths and we look close and it was a walleye and that was way uper
1:01:13
30s and we' we've also not we a person actually has caught a 37 out of our leg
1:01:19
so I know they're there it's a rare rare fish but it's neat to see like like it's like you're in a in an aquarium and the
1:01:25
fish are just all over the place I want nothing to do with you which is fine you don't want to be catching those fish anyway uh because sometimes based on the
1:01:33
ice out uh while I season can open and they're still really haven't spawned yet so you got to be careful but it's neat
1:01:39
to watch in Crystal Clear Water where they're just all over the place just like you're in a bass proo or Cabellas Wow have you noticed Through The Years
1:01:46
there's better years or is it always pretty consistent uh in the spawn in
1:01:51
terms of numbers yeah just seeing them you know being mesmerized seems pretty consistent honestly we're we're so
1:01:56
slammed with work that we don't sit there for hours on end doing counts like they do in the salmon hatcheries or Fisheries so it seems pretty consistent
1:02:04
and my guides get a kick out of going out and kind of looking at it and taking pictures and we've gotten the underwater drone out and Gone Gone In which is kind
1:02:11
of neat it's pretty cool Ted you mentioned Pike a moment ago you know one thing that we U I don't even do we ever
1:02:17
have we ever caught a pike I I had a question on there why have we never caught a northern pike big or small on
1:02:23
Lake because he just said something that just went off of my head we've never made contact with Pike there we know
1:02:28
that we've heard of Pike living there but I just wonder because normally an environment
1:02:35
that has Pike in it they tend to dominate quite a bit in your Lake that's
1:02:41
not the case and I'm just wondering if it's not because of the size of your walleye are these big 25 26 27in walleye
1:02:50
that are obviously there's a ton of them are they keeping Pike in check you you think that's a good question I I mean
1:02:57
that might be part of it I mean the other part is we've got so much other food that the P Pike are going after I
1:03:04
mean a perch doesn't make it past their sixth birthday they're done so the cisos are everywhere the pike are eating big
1:03:10
big white fish so I think there's just a buffet out there now if this was just a pike bass walleye lake I think there may
1:03:16
be a lot more competition and they would be really going after those walleye um but I haven't really noticed that now we
1:03:23
have Pike a big Pike for us is over 40 but we catch you know maybe a few dozen over 40 most of them are mid-30s um we
1:03:30
have better Pike lakes on the on our sort of out Lakes to go fish uh for whatever reason it's better um but we
1:03:37
have Pike most people aren't targeting Pike if you want Pike go to Northern Saskatchewan and just Northern Manitoba and tear it
1:03:42
[Music]
1:03:51
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1:04:28
episode what speaking of Pike give us a your recollection the biggest walleye
1:04:34
from you from your Lodge people or you Pike and lak trout let's say what are the what are the three and small moou
1:04:40
what do you think the biggest walleye came out it was caught by not by one of our guests it was a guest that was here years ago but they were on their own
1:04:46
that was a 37inch walleye biggest pike I've ever seen is I think 48 wow lake
1:04:51
trout I mean we we don't get big lake trout or big lake trout for us is you know a 30inch lake trout but they're a lot of fun you catch them all summer you
1:04:58
know get out with your graph and you know jig for them in 80 ft of water it's kind of kind of a blast you can mix it up yeah yeah small mouth how big's mly
1:05:04
the biggest one you small mouth uh went 811 oh my god oh you got a m that's un
1:05:10
usual you're not going to catch aound Smallmouth guys slow down relax we know buddy we know we never have so that's
1:05:17
what I mean there's something about that body of water that that that Walley
1:05:23
by the way that Ted's talking about that 37 that's a 17 18 at least 18 lb fish probably or bigger maybe I don't know
1:05:29
who knows did they say a weight the 37 I think just went over 19 pounds so there you again not not my guest fish but it
1:05:37
was a people that had fished the lake before uh and they're very secretive and I appreciate that but it was a beautiful
1:05:43
fish uh and the picture was amazing my God that's big that's just I think there's something in the water man I
1:05:50
don't care what you say I think you're you're putting you're putting something in there you're not telling
1:05:55
us it's got to be Ted I wish it were that easy Teddy's Big Balls dragging in the water cuz you got the balls to say
1:06:00
Catch and Release only people no no keeping anything I uh all right we've taken a
1:06:07
turn you must you must talk to a lot of uh I know you go to the tourism shows
1:06:14
and whatnot uh you must talk to a lot of your peers about or or maybe not do they
1:06:21
talk to you about your management practices do you get other operators saying hey Teddy you keep I keep hearing
1:06:27
about this Hawk Lake and Hawk Lake Lodge and and how you manage like is there anything you can
1:06:33
tell me that maybe I could use on my Lake as well do you get that or or they pretty much standoffish when it comes to
1:06:41
that okay that was like three questions in one couple things we actually just won the conservation award for noo for
1:06:46
this year so we're pretty proud of that for our conservation practices um congrats when when I first started like
1:06:52
I was getting a lot of strange looks like log owners like dude what are you doing this is ridiculous we need Shore
1:06:57
lunches my my guests will never do this no way um but now that we're in year 14
1:07:03
or 15 they're they're more receptive I think what I've heard is they're just
1:07:09
nervous about alienating a part of their clientele that has always caught and kept fish you can't blame them and I
1:07:16
kind of pissed off a few of my clients who wanted to keep fish and bring them home so they think they're nervous and
1:07:21
as you just said an you know it takes some big balls or you just got to you just got to do it you got to rip off the Band-Aid and do it and think about
1:07:29
longer term don't not the first couple years you're going to lose a little business once those fish grow up I
1:07:34
guarantee you you're going to get 10 times the business for someone that's going to be able to catch a nice big fish um but that's to each his own um I
1:07:42
know people are nervous and it's it's not common uh it's but I think people are paying a little more attention now
1:07:49
which is good because you you got to think of this fishery 10 years down the road have you ever had uh biologists or
1:07:55
anybody like that ask you about your you what you've got in place there honestly I never have and that kind of makes me
1:08:01
sad I think it's kind of a neat neat neat case it's a neat example something that kind of works they should be
1:08:06
digging in so if you know anybody stand in my way well I was going to say if anybody's listening that is with even
1:08:13
with M&R or anybody such as that I highly recommend that you at least reach
1:08:21
out to this man and ask him some questions that may help us better manage
1:08:27
some of our other Fisheries cuz I was just thinking as you were talking about people being nervous about converting
1:08:33
their lodges to Total release fishy could you imagine what would happen over
1:08:39
say I don't know how many years it would take well how many years did it take first of all before I go on can you bring us back to 14 years ago when you
1:08:46
first decided you woke up one morning and said yeah I'm going to do it how long did it take you to establish
1:08:55
yourself you mean how long did it take to make the decision or how long did it take to implement the decision to to
1:09:00
implement and see results well it was implemented instantly it was yes or no I you can't
1:09:06
be a little bit pregnant you either do it or you don't right so we did it right off the back that was I'm pretty sure my
1:09:12
first year which was 2011 my first summer we started seeing results within the first six years which makes sense
1:09:19
because that means the 17 inches are now 22 23 24 uh so then five or six years
1:09:25
but it's was sort of an exponential curve once we H about year nine or 10 then all of a sudden the big fish were
1:09:31
getting bigger and the smaller fish were coming back and it just sort of it all flourished almost all at once the last
1:09:37
three years and it was really too bad because we had Co like it was just awesome and we were just crushing and I was just really hoping my guests could
1:09:43
experience it but now they can did you but Ted did you buy the lodge or did you build a lodge like was there somebody there before you and you took it over oh
1:09:51
yeah you know the lodge was built well it was built built as a private place in the mid-50s was turned into a lodge in
1:09:57
the mid 80s I'm the third Lodge owner okay so the lodge has been in existence since the mid 80s okay so they had catch
1:10:03
and keep and and eat and all that stuff and that's why you probably came to that decision of hey we should do something
1:10:10
different I'm assuming right yeah I just I mean once I call my first 30 you know I was like wow this is really cool let's
1:10:15
keep doing it and again so honestly it was kind of a shot in the dark but I think I think I hit
1:10:22
the bullz you did I was good as say though earlier so can you imagine
1:10:27
if obviously not all but a large portion of the operators decided you know what
1:10:34
if he can do it I can do it too and they for the next five or six years went to a
1:10:40
total release policy at some of these places can you imagine the fishery that we would discover in this part of the
1:10:45
world I mean it would be it would be it'd be insane but I'll tell you what though the the average clientele out
1:10:52
there won't do it cuz head's clientele says you know what I want to catch a 26 27 a 32in walleye that's what I'm going
1:10:59
up there for I know I can't have short lunch so I'm just going to go there and try and crack a big one or two or three the majority of clients as we see in all
1:11:06
these other lodges their favorite part of it is Shor lunch eating them up and maybe even taking some home with you you know what I mean so it'd be a hard one
1:11:13
you know to uh to take change in all The Lodges that's for sure so right I'd like
1:11:19
to see more of them do it though buddy that'd be cool that's for sure it can happen Ted shows you it can happen yeah
1:11:24
right as long as you got a good a snoggy lake it's a perfect L well they have got a decent catch and release uh policy in
1:11:29
there now right L 8 I'm sure used no they didn't so they they've taken a step
1:11:35
forward and you know what it's going to take some time you can watch that Lake's going to start cracking some big ones again a lot of big ones again very soon
1:11:42
uh weather changes are you concerned at all um about haot global warming or
1:11:49
something this weekend I mean obviously I mean overall we've had some pretty crazy weather patterns in this
1:11:57
part of the world anyways I don't know about up there uh in Northwestern Ontario but if you have noticed weather
1:12:04
changes you know even if it's 2 or three degrees is there any concern uh from your part that it may at some point
1:12:10
affect your fishery well of course there's always concern and here's where I am out of my
1:12:17
element I'm certainly am not a biologist and how that's going to affect the the water conditions and concentrated oxygen
1:12:23
levels etc etc um right now I haven't really seen any
1:12:29
changes it's a deep lake so there's plenty of cool water uh The Bait fish are you know can can go below that
1:12:34
thermocline for sure or certainly around that thermocline where there's a high concentration of oxygen just above it uh
1:12:42
I don't think it's an issue but I really wouldn't want to be here in 40 years I think our next generation is going to
1:12:48
have have a reckoning to do and it's kind of sad in my opinion it's going to be tough yeah Point Teddy have you ever
1:12:54
speaking of weather have you or any of your guides or any of your friends or whatever ever ice fished on Hawk Lake
1:13:01
wow honestly once one time I got up there in
1:13:06
like late April we still had a foot of ice and an ice fish and I guess they call it ice drinking up there where you
1:13:11
just dig a hole and look at the hole the whole time I mean it really didn't appeal to me all that much um but I guess if there's nothing else to do in
1:13:17
the middle of nowhere I could see where it's fun you get a couch you get your TV your food you do a little fishing so the quick answer is know but if I lived half
1:13:25
an hour from there I'd be out there ice fishing every weekend absolutely I think that'd be uh because now there's no one
1:13:31
on the lakes for the most part I bet you there's some monsters coming up especially the bouret too I guess the bouret fishing gets really good in the
1:13:38
winter that's what all my gues tell all my guides tell me so that would be pretty fun uh quickly before we let you
1:13:44
go give folks an idea of Hawk Lake Lodge what are they apt to expect when they come up there what uh what uh what do
1:13:51
you offer that they need to know about well I mean unlike many of other
1:13:57
places where we're very high-end we're pricey but with that price it come service you know it's open bar with Wine
1:14:03
sellers and every cabin has a private hot tub uh we only have 20 to 25 people
1:14:08
a night there are more staff uh than we actually have people we have you know 18 to 19 staff uh it's topnotch we have a
1:14:15
cordon blue Chef we've got 22 private Lakes so every day you're the only boat on that water which is pretty cool you
1:14:21
get to mix it up uh uh you know we we we went in a different direction uh to be
1:14:26
higher end and that coupled with the fishing which has sort of exploded it's sort of it's been fishing Nana that's
1:14:32
for sure I told a person one time that asked me about it uh the best way I
1:14:38
could describe it to him was think of this as the creu high-end cruise ships
1:14:44
of Fishing lodges what do you mean just think about that open Bar happy hour uh
1:14:51
hot tubs uh all of wonderful amenities that you think of a cruise ship and
1:14:56
throw in a bonus that you can go out at any time during your stay and probably are in a real good position to land
1:15:05
yourself a double digit walleye every time I so true that's what I see it as is a cruise ship the food is the same as
1:15:12
being on a cruise ship so one of our one of the best just to be clear we're not just a w life fish we actually got
1:15:17
famous for being a smallmouth fish godou Smallmouth fish off the charts most people go Smallmouth fish and then catch
1:15:23
30s at night one thing I'm intrigued about and before I hang it up I'm going to come up to Hawk Lake Lodge and just
1:15:30
for small M bass because I think we talked about it on this program last you
1:15:35
were last time you were here one uh evening when we were coming back from
1:15:40
the other part of the lake Walley fishing we came through the Narrows and just as we turned to come towards the
1:15:45
lodge off to the left hand side there's a little point and we saw the biggest
1:15:53
School of smallmouth on the surface thrashing around you could tell there's
1:15:58
small most of the time they were out of the water and you could see that black silhouette and and they were just
1:16:04
thrashing probis and then I asked you about it and that's what you said that happens oh yeah that happens every night
1:16:10
I want to Happ every night it's a blast I want to come back there and throw some some twitch baits and uh just have a
1:16:18
blast some top water baits any of that stuff be a riot my God could you imagine oh imagine oh my God that'd be cool yeah
1:16:24
come up in June actually Al Linder is coming up in this June we're actually finishing finalizing his dates right now so be kind of cool to have these two old
1:16:32
gentlemen in the lives at the same time oh you're talking about the the linders not us old oh no not you no not you okay
1:16:39
all right anyways Ted always a pleasure having you on my friend uh it's a blast
1:16:46
thank you for uh being our uh in-house book reviewer and reviewing the uh
1:16:52
Walley beautiful fish of of the dark for us um me and Oprah you and Oprah yeah
1:16:59
yeah there you go it's it's and go Bruins go I it's not our year if anybody
1:17:04
I'd rather have you win than anybody else so there you go wow guys thanks guys I appreciate it always a pleasure
1:17:10
my friend see you teddy Ted putam uh Hawk Lake Lodge Hawk Lake Ontario walleye Mecca I was going to say
1:17:18
there one of the my favorite parts of Haw lake lodges is at the end of the day of fishing day happy hour you're having
1:17:25
a drink on the deck and you're having a nice cigar with that drink on the deck before supper you know talking to everybody else's fish stories it
1:17:32
honestly gets no better people and they all have a great fish story know that they're not lying to you you got 29 and
1:17:37
you don't have the biggest fish of the day you're thinking oh no who's going to beat me now anyways uh great operation
1:17:43
it's not for everybody uh it is as Ted just mentioned it is highend yep and when you look at
1:17:49
those prices you say ouch but once in a lifetime you deserve it sure
1:17:57
no question about it uh what else we got it's the uh time to to sign off I want to remind everybody once again uh
1:18:04
fishing canada.com the Gateway the portal to your next fishing Adventure is loaded with all kinds of goodies that
1:18:11
we're giving away I heard new contest starting up it's I I don't know if I can throw this out there but I'm going to
1:18:18
throw it out there I heard that we are soon going to have uh Princecraft Bol
1:18:24
motor and Mercury bolt motor trailer and Mercury Princecraft uh products giving
1:18:30
you I'm pretty sure I'm pretty sure we have at least one of those at least one
1:18:37
of those going on there so there may be more than one there is you never know you never know there is there's a couple
1:18:44
of them for sure uh also the store I mean hey look at hey now look what I'm
1:18:50
talking about here even Dean's got it on de the dancing ma doesn't no he doesn't
1:18:56
participate in that W's on his own there well he's very stylish he's like European stylish right we have to we
1:19:01
have to get a European cut uh fishing Canada art J swag I think we should have vaa on the show on the fishing Canada
1:19:09
show or the Outdoor Journal uh Radio podcast I think we should have them on this radio uh uh podcast uh platform
1:19:16
first and then put him on the show then I think he should uh jump in front of
1:19:21
the camera he'll tell you that you're have to shoot it you know that you're going to have to get that uh Sony camera all working to the Perfection too right
1:19:29
not to not to not to this no no this just came to mind I just had a meeting
1:19:34
as you know downtown with a professional um today and when it was all said and
1:19:40
done I said by the way if you ever want to go and he he doesn't know me from Adam just so that you know okay and I
1:19:45
said if you ever want to go fishing uh you know I can hook you up it's fishing
1:19:51
what would I want to do that for he says say I'm a vegetarian I said okay wow so
1:19:57
you're vegetan no no I say so you're a vegetarian what does that have to do with fishing you can't go out and fish
1:20:03
without consuming say you guys do that like he was completely like like he gave
1:20:10
me this face did you guys actually do that he was literally clueless to that going on in this world yeah wow and the
1:20:17
reason I think it would be interesting to have vaa on the fishing Canada show is because it would be an interesting
1:20:23
point of view to find out what goes through his mind well I know was very
1:20:29
excited when his first timey at BC I remember him trying to catch fish and he he was fishing I've seen him with with
1:20:36
yeah so so he he's definitely uh let's try it out so well was our cameram man for those of you who don't know uh both
1:20:43
here on this show and the fishing CET show and with that in mind I I think it's time we signed off Mr B unless you
1:20:49
have something else that you want to throw no I think we're good we did everything uh and all that stuff on behalf of uh the entire Outdoor Journal
1:20:56
Radio podcast team uh B come on now Nick who is somewhere uh Dean Taylor
1:21:04
back uh Mr Bowman I'm Angelo Biola thanks for joining us folks we'll talk
1:21:09
to you next
1:21:15
[Music] [Applause] [Music]
1:21:21
time oh
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